Amanda: Hey guys, welcome back to the podcast. I am Amanda.
Laura: I'm Laura.
Kendra: And I'm Kendra.
Amanda: And today we are so excited because We have a special guest, Dr. Santi Tanikela. She is a board certified pediatrician, integrative medicine specialist, as well as a coach.
And a Reiki practitioner, yes?
Santi: Yeah.
Amanda: She is joining us today to talk about meditation. Thank you so, so much, Santi, for joining us today.
Santi: Thank you all. I'm so jazzed to be here today.
Laura: Oh, we're so excited to have you here. You're one of our favorite people, so can't wait for our listeners to hear all of your goodness.
So tell us a little bit about you, where you trained, where you live, what you like to do, all that good stuff.
Santi: Thank you so much. Absolutely. So I'm largely here on the East Coast. I went to medical school at Drexel University. I did my residency over at the Children's Hospital at Montefiore, which is associated with Albert Einstein up in the Bronx.
And now I'm here in Pennsylvania. And. I practice general pediatrics as well as pediatric integrative medicine. I also have a business in which I provide coaching, like you guys said, and I teach mind body therapies virtually. So it's really awesome to not just be limited to Pennsylvania, but now I have a national and international reach, which has been a really cool experience.
Laura: That is awesome. So tell us If you were to define meditation, how would you do that?
Santi: Yeah, so from a historical perspective, meditation has been practiced for thousands of years. So you can find it across various cultures and practices, and because of this, it can be used in several different ways. So I find that meditation is more of an umbrella term, which is why it's not so easy to define. In my use, I actually put meditation in the group of mind body therapies because I find that that way we have a broader understanding of what it is capable of doing and what it can offer to people who use it.
I know originally, you know, meditation was meant to help deepen the understanding of the sacred, but what I'm finding is now it's finding a really beautiful home in the healthcare system and it's often used for relaxation and stress reductions.
Laura: Which we all need don't we?
Santi: Yeah, totally. That's how I got into it for sure.
Laura: So why is meditation something that we should try when we're already so busy and have so little time?
Santi: It's true. We, we are really busy all the time. And when our bodies are not busy, our minds are still busy. So what I want to offer is that meditation, mindfulness, mind, body therapies overall have a way of being able to slow that jumbled activity that's happening in our mind so that we're actually able to enjoy the present moment for what it is.
And. It is, it doesn't sound like it could be easy. I think when we talk about meditation and mindfulness, we imagine the sage that's sitting at the top of the mountain and it's a beautiful sunrise and right now, listen, the conditions don't need to be perfect to be able to practice this. We really can be meditating while we're washing the dishes or folding the laundry.
You know, we can integrate it into our days. It doesn't have to be hard. So yeah. I think. In that way, it's a win win because you can still get your stuff done, but you're able to bring in a new level of awareness that you might not have been able to do before.
Laura: Yeah. And with your reference to that mind jumble, do you find that meditation actually helps provide some clarity and helps our thinking processes to be more, well, I guess less jumbled?
Santi: I do. I find That when people start to engage in mind in mindfulness meditation or mind body practices that they're able to actually now follow these linear strands of thought. So, instead of it continuing to stay jumbled like that, right? There's some organization to the thought processes, and then once you're a little bit more organized in your brain, you're beginning, you, you give yourself the ability to pick up on themes, right?
So, let's take some intense emotions, right? Like, what are the triggers that make you angry? Huh, I've noticed that when the dishes are in the sink. I'm angry when the clothes are on the floor. I'm angry when, right, like, and the list goes on. When my, you know, senses in the ER or my senses at work is high, I'm angry.
Nothing even happened yet. I'm already angry, right? Like, you know, so being able to pick up on specific themes and then being able to say, yes, I know I'm going to get angry when I see that that sense is high. What can I do beforehand to prevent those emotions from popping up where maybe I actually have a full census, but maybe, you know, like 80 percent of it is just easy stuff like colds and, you know, a toe injury, right?
Like things that are very, very manageable and easy to take care of, right? Like we're not jumping on it with our emotions and then allowing it to wreak havoc in our bodies and our minds. What we're able to do is create this space of buffer, right? Like if you've ever watched the Matrix, right? How like when, when the people are assaulted, right?
They're able to kind of move back and pivot and move aside from that source of, of injury, right? Like that's what I try to create for my clients and for my patients is we're going to create this buffer space so that instead of getting hit, you're able to move aside, look at it, have some emotional distance from it.
And then create a course of action that works for you. It's a much, it sounds like Yeah, I don't have time for meditation, but it's almost like we would have more time actually, if we did do this, we would have more mental space. And then not only that, but when we end up having these really beautiful interactions with the people around us, whether it's family or friends or patients, that we're able to actually sit in and revel.
in the beauty of that. That's a great thing to be able to have.
Amanda: Kind of like the idea too, like, if you think you don't have time for meditation, you probably need a double dose.
Laura: Yeah.
Santi: Yeah. It's so true. It's true for all of the self care, right? Like, Oh, I don't have time to eat. I don't have time to go to the bathroom.
I don't have time to sleep. What is it going to take for you to finally make that time to care for yourself so that your quality of life overall is better? And also too, like, as physicians, we're, you know, crying from the rooftops. Hey, everybody, you got to eat, sleep, and do all these things for your own self care.
Otherwise, you're going to end up in your, you know, PCP's office or in the ER with something worse. Wouldn't it have been Better to just prevent it in the first place, right? Like, so if we can't, well, you know, talk our talk and walk our walk, like, well, what is there, right?
Kendra: Yeah, that's really good. I think that is good.
I mean, we could wrap up right there because that is like hashtag facts. I mean, we're always preaching about that and there's something to the actual. True authentic self speaking. So if you're preaching that and you're not being your authentic self, I'm, I'm pretty sure that's why we may not have been able to get the reliability that we need from our patients, so, Santi, a lot of us out there have tried meditation and because we're so busy or because we have so much on our minds that we can't really get in into it, be present, clear our thoughts. So are we doing it wrong? Explain a little for our listeners.
Santi: Not at all. So if any of you have ever taken an introductory mindfulness based stress reduction class, in the very first class, they tell you about something called monkey brain, which is literally like your thoughts are, you know, like a monkey.
Jumping from branch to branch, right? Like, first you're thinking about the to do list for today, and then you're thinking about, you know, at the grocery store, someone said something to me. And then it just tangentially, right? Like, these tangential thoughts, right? We're all victims to this. And, you know, it is inherent to us, actually.
And so when we are practicing something like mindfulness based stress reduction, what they recommend is to be able to focus on something specific, right? Focus on the breath, focus on the present moment. And guess what you guys, I cannot tell you how hard it was for me to be able to focus on my breath and to focus on the present moment.
My my first, this was my first true meditation class. I was a Second year medical student. This was literally harder than studying the Krebs Cycle, like, I cannot even tell you how frustrated I was, how less than I felt, like, and, you know, the feeling of, I'm smart, I know I'm smart, why can't I do this?
You know, and the truth is, is we're not all built like this. Right. Some of us have, and especially, I would say, right, like you guys are ER physicians, this tangential sort of way of thinking is actually life saving for your patients, right? It's life saving, right? You are able to go into a patient in room one, and then Hear the, hear the medical alerts go off and run to room 3, do the code, come back to room 1, go to room 2, check on room, you know, like, it's a lot.
So, if you have trained yourself to be that way, I'm not going to tell you to undo that training, but perhaps we can just scale it back just a little bit so that your mind can rest. So for people who have a lot of trouble, you know, focusing on something like the breath or sitting still, there are definitely other modalities that are out there.
That can better suit you. So for me, I found that yoga was the thing that actually matched up best for me. So in yoga, you pair your physical movement with breath. So I got to not just experience the breath, I experienced the movement, the stretch, the sensations in my body. And because I had something to hang my mind on, that held my attention better.
And I was able to focus on the present moment. For other people, it might not be yoga. Maybe it's Tai Chi or Qigong, which are also movement meditations. Some people talk about taking a walk in nature and being able to clear their mind. Guess what, you guys? That's meditation, right? Going for a run, meditation, right?
Like, so there are things that many of us actually probably do on a day to day, knowing that it actually helps to settle us. And that might be your form of meditation. There are also modalities like guided imagery, where you can listen to a recording or have someone live guide you through verbally a mental image or series of images.
So that you have something to focus on. Like a, a relaxing scene, such as like a beach scene or standing at the top of a mountain when the sun is setting. And then for still others, and this, particularly for the skeptics, biofeedback is an amazing tool. So biofeedback is a modality in which you can actually have a sensor put onto your body, whether it's your ear or your finger.
Okay. And you can actually study the metrics as you are engaging in a mindfulness or meditation. So the easiest actually, like you guys have pulse oxes in your, your setting, right? So if you have a person that's coming in with. white coat syndrome, and then you walk them through a very simple breathing exercise where they just kind of slow that breathing down, you may actually find that that heart rate starts to steadily go back into a normal range.
That is like the simplest form of biofeedback. So there are other forms of biofeedback out there, like heart rate variability biofeedback, which is what I teach where you're looking at the heart rate variability from beat to beat. And. And basically comparing it to what your mental state is, so for people who are seeing what's happening on the screen, they start out with what looks like a scrambled pattern, and then as they engage in deep breathing and meditation exercises, what appears is this really beautiful sine wave.
So when they have that, that visual image in real time, all of a sudden it dawns on them, like, That's what I have to do to get it right. And so I have found that this has expedited my patients experience so that they're not sitting there guessing the first five times that they're meditating. They're not guessing whether they're doing it right or not anymore.
They're like, okay. I've got it now. I just have to keep going. It's really motivating for them. So yeah, there's a ton of different things out there that we can use to be able to settle our minds and our bodies. And I find too, it's a great segue for coaching.
Kendra: Yeah, that's awesome. I like think about the times when you've actually kind of been able to like take a moment and be present and figure that out.
And, you know, I'm, I, you know, do the daily gratitude practice and in the mornings, and I find that's when I'm, you know, really able to reset like right after the kids, you know, leave, get them off to school and then like have a few minutes because I've been intentional about that. But what if someone's out there being like, I don't even have time to put gas in my car or get the groceries.
Is there benefit to just doing. Small sessions throughout the day or like a a intentional time once a week or what would you recommend?
Santi: Yeah, so these were skills that I developed during my residency. So I had what was called the elevator meditation. We're literally, right, like we're running labs up, you know, running blood work up to the lab.
And I'm like, okay, I have about five seconds before we get to the floor. I'm going to just do some deep breathing here. So as the elevator is moving, I'm getting into that zone and doing my deep breathing and letting everything just mentally slow down. There's nothing I can do for my patients in this moment anyways, so might as well take advantage of it and just breathe.
You know, similarly, like when I would collect supplies, right? Like, oh, I have to get casting equipment we've done this enough times. We know what we need. We can allow this to be a time where our mind can relax just a little bit. So yeah, absolutely. I find that that's a great reset button.
And one of the things that I learned too was in my mindfulness based stress reduction class was the stop. Be, breathe, meditation. The person that was teaching the class was a physician. And so what he recommended was before you go in to your patient, you put your hand on the doorknob. That way the nurse thinks that you're going to go in, so they don't interrupt you.
That's in an ideal world, right? So you put your hand on the doorknob, you stop, take a deep breath in,
and then you tell yourself, just be. And then you turn the doorknob and go in. So even just that, where you're mentally resetting for that next patient, so huge, because they know when we are distracted, they know when we're not all there, and it immediately, when they, when that's the first thing that they notice as you're walking in, Already, the guards and defenses go up, sadly, right?
So when you go in with presence and focus and you make eye contact, those, those guards start to fall a little, like that trust develops a little and the, the interaction then with your patient is so much easier. So, yes, there's absolutely benefit to doing one or two breath meditations and it's really possible.
Amanda: I love, first of all, that permission to have random thoughts during a meditation. Session and kind of that's the point like to just notice that that's happening and reset. That's good because I certainly have a lot of practice at trying to redirect my thoughts because they're everywhere. My first experience with meditation actually was on accident.
I didn't even know that this was what was happening, but I went to Busch Gardens in Tampa and we sat down where they're rehabilitating the manatees. And those, you know, giant sea cows like slowly moving and I don't even know how long we were sitting there, but when my sister in law was like, hey are we ready to go?
I realized I had not had a single thought. Which is probably the first time that's ever happened in my life was like, I think I just meditated. All I need is a manatee. Should be simple enough. Well for anyone who hasn't tried to Meditate, would you be open to just walking us through like a one or two minute Sample to see what it's like and that would mean that anyone driving Don't do this.
Don't close your eyes, but like maybe just keep your eyes open and keep driving. But what do you think?
Santi: Yeah, absolutely. I would love to. Okay. All right, guys, let's do this. All right. So for those of you who are not driving or operating heavy machinery, I encourage you to go ahead and sit back in your chairs
and take a deep breath in. I'm going to bring that breath all the way down into our bellies. As you exhale, allow your shoulders to relax, allow your jaw to relax, get your arms into a comfortable position where they can just drop into your lap. Allow your chair to fully support you.
On your next inhale, imagine that your heart is starting to open,
just that space around your heart, all that tenseness and stress that you carry. Allow that all to melt away so that that area in your chest can just be,
imagine a beautiful, soft, golden glow starting to emanate from the space
as you inhale and exhale. Imagine that this glow is expanding as it expands.
You feel the warmth of that glow, that warmth radiates into your belly, shoulders, down your arms, down your legs, into your neck,
and finally your mind.
There's a sense of peace that comes over you, that
this beautiful glow is there only for you to nourish you. Unconditionally love you for who you are and who you strive to be.
Allow this beautiful glow to embrace you.
Just feel, feel that in your body. Notice how your body relaxes into this.
When you are ready to come back to the present moment,
gently wiggle your toes, wiggle your fingers, and slowly open your eyes.
Welcome back.
Amanda: God, that was amazing. One of my monkey thoughts was like, I need one of these before every shift. Like, do you have that? So are we correct that you have a meditation course or offerings? Is that? Cuz man. I could have used this before, well, I can use this before every shift, probably after every shift too.
I think my heart rate came down by several points.
Santi: I'm so glad you found this helpful. Yeah, we have launched our first self paced meditation course. It's called Calm & Empowered and you can find it on our website. It offers. 10 videos that allow you to move through the very beginning stages of meditation, like learning how to do breath work.
And then it moves you into mindfulness practices all the way up into guided imagery where the videos are a little bit longer and more detailed. And the beautiful thing about this is actually this is adapted from. what I have learned to be most beneficial for my patients. So it's truly a compilation of meditations that I used in practice and they were so impactful for my patients.
So I really think that this will be impactful to others. Right now the prices are really low, so I encourage. anybody and everybody to try it out and see what they think of it. And if you like it, pass it on to your family, your friends, even your patients. I think it reaches people in a way that's different from what we're usually able to offer as physicians, right?
It's, it's heart centered. And once people get the hang of using these practices, they're able to adapt it for their own uses and transform it. And then you don't need me anymore. Which is truly the goal, right?
Amanda: That's amazing. So, you mentioned on your website What I have is iamwellmd.com is that the best way to get a hold of you or to find these things?
Santi: Yep, iamwellmd.com I'll give you guys some of the contacts in my show notes but I'm YouTube and Facebook, Instagram. So if you ever have any questions or you want to learn more, totally hit me up.
Amanda: And so I'm imagining for patients that this would be really helpful before a procedure or before an operation, before a lab draw, something like that could be You know, just to take your anxiety, you know, from level 1000 to something a little bit.
Santi: Yeah, absolutely. So there are actually studies showing the benefits of practices such as guided imagery and even hypnosis pre procedurally. And there was even one study that compared, I think it was guided imagery, to use of midazolam and found that the guided imagery. Was more beneficial with less side effects than midazolam.
That, that study floored me.
Amanda: Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah. We need to get one of your guided imageries on replay in the waiting room. Well, yeah. I've been asking for like a midazolam spritzer all the time, but maybe we just need guided imagery.
Laura: That would be amazing. I'll say that. I participated in one of Santi's guided imageries a little over a year ago, and it was life changing for me.
It really was. I still, I still look back on that experience with awe and gratitude. Thank you for being so amazing.
Santi: Thank you, Laura. Thank you for allowing me to be here today. I just, I love, I love talking to you guys and I always say guys. So don't mind me when I say that. I love talking to you ladies, but, you know, I love being able to share.
Truly what I perceive to be my life's work in this profound way.
Amanda: Are there any last thoughts that you have before we close out?
Santi: Gosh, happy holidays, everybody! You know, I, I will say that I have definitely had my share of holiday stress, and I don't know about all of you, but this, this thing, this piece of being able to have Gratitude, appreciation, and pairing that with the deep breathing has really allowed me to enjoy the holiday season so much more than I have in previous years, so I feel like every time I come upon an obstacle that I know is stressful, it provides me with an opportunity to to grow and to make my skills more more impactful. So I will leave all of you with that, that, you know, people think that there's a magic pill out there and it's not always a magic pill. Sometimes it really is just trial, error, practice and augmentation. And over time, Life changes and then we have to do it all again, all over again. We learn it all over again and that is life, right?
So it's a beautiful thing.
Kendra: Thank you, Santi, so much for being here today. And we want you to click the link below to join our email list. If you're not already receiving our weekly well check, visit our website, www.thewholephysician.com to get more information. So until next time you are whole, you are a gift to medicine and the work you do matters.
